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Hollywood Supportpage  1 2 

Wawa T

Posts 695
28 May 2017 13:44


Vojin Vidanovic wrote:

Just because its more permanent and hardware accelerated solution,

how is it more permament? the source is not even accessible.
do you even understand what i write? obviously not. please try harder..

i propose wazp3d source as an actual base for a hardare accelearted solution. you can take alains source, accelerate function for function with ammx calls or whatever there is available and deliver apollo wazp3d version which will be effectively warp3d dropin replacement for this particular hardware..

facepalm! 


  But, since Classic market is growing again, sheer interest or numbers might give some profit incent, compared to sales of Enhancer OS4.

have you even observed the series of drama arising around hyperion/aeon/os4/cloanto again in the last few days? you want even now convince us to put ourselves on mercy of these "professional" entities again?

 
  Since they kind of have Enhancer OS3 in works minus RadeonHD drivers, essentialy just the updated Warp3D with SAGA support would raise its value as an option and would become interest of all Vampire owners.
 
  Will they see the opportunity is highly unlikely.

none has ever seen this os3 enchancer kit. even if it was any valuable except for existing classes replacements and some pay for eyecandy.

please dont go around again as an advertisement herold for some "commercial" companies. they may well take care of it themselves, without volonteers. you should have learned something from your encounters with os4/hyperion/aeon.


Vojin Vidanovic

Posts 770
28 May 2017 15:05


Yes, they have lost Amiga On Lake, likely because they decide
  to prioritize dealers, even AOL had demand. I assume delays, not full packages delivered etc. has caused this little trouble and should be a lesson to AEON/Amigakit.
 
  Its good oportunity for Vampire standalone to US market as Amiga On Lake was a decent saler. I have my own grunches why I skipped AmigaKit and moved to Amedia, France as my dealer.
 
  I do understand AEON has yet to proveitself in 68k world. I am just saying that simple opportunity to fund and survive might drive them to 68k releases of whatever they have licenses too.
 
  I know its highly unlikely, knowing e.g. Steven Solies ego on my own skin. But its about time Trevor has a mind of his own, at least as bussiness man. Or he will ruin his own bussiness.
 
  I am just saying real HW accelerated driver would be best as sof emulation takes CPU power which is limited on Vampire. As Vampire owner Wawa try 68k Wazp3d and some app and I believe this is where more then 90Mhz would be needed. Its speculative and based on my 1.8Ghz PA Semi (lets say 1Ghz G4 in relative speed) experience when I was forced to use it, as w3d support never appeared for my 6870 Radeon HD, even it was promised.
 
  Surely, Vampire is build to be scalable design and could compensate by software optimizations, but I a bit doubt it as real solution on current design. A stopgap maybe.


Rob M

Posts 54
28 May 2017 20:21


wawa t wrote:
 
  please dont go around again as an advertisement herold for some "commercial" companies. they may well take care of it themselves, without volonteers. you should have learned something from your encounters with os4/hyperion/aeon.

And now Amikit is stocking the Vampire 500.  Co-operation on software might not be so far out of the question as you may think.




Wawa T

Posts 695
28 May 2017 20:43


you mean amiga-kit. they sell also elbox accelerators. yet elbox had to pay hyperion for warp3d support for voodoo and warp3d support for radeon has never happened. casching up upon something succesful is easy. cooperation is another matter.


Rob M

Posts 54
28 May 2017 21:42


wawa t wrote:

you mean amiga-kit. they sell also elbox accelerators. yet elbox had to pay hyperion for warp3d support for voodoo and warp3d support for radeon has never happened. casching up upon something succesful is easy. cooperation is another matter.

That was in 2001 or so wasn't it.  Hyperion don't have a stake in Warp3D.  It's co-owned by A-EON and the Frieden brothers at the moment.  I did asked Matthew if they'd consider a 68K driver for the Radeon 7500-9250 and he said it is a consideration.  I think this and a Warp3D driver all come down to whether someone is prepared to approach A-EON and offer to do the work.


Wawa T

Posts 695
28 May 2017 21:53


Rob M wrote:
 
  That was in 2001 or so wasn't it.
 

  elbox? probably. but im talking of an initiative few years back. i dont remember who asked and whom. probably timothy. maybe alain recalls something.
 
  what concerns your talks with matthew. sure, be my guest and find someone who do the job, probably for free, as it was with prisma megamix if i recall right. they will likely need to sign an nda anyway, which may negatively reflect on availability of these coders for further amiga-m68k projects. but whatever..


Vojin Vidanovic

Posts 770
28 May 2017 22:40


I dont believe it that easy, even its nice to see some unity.

Skilled coder willing to work for free? Hmm ... I assume there is anyone willing to try, or even if it would, they must have a commercial interest.

If Hans is free of Warp3D Nova and is willing to accept a public
fundraiser be it Power2People or Kickstarter, it can be crowfounded easily as there is enough interest.

Huno is willing to do Vampire ports, but needs Warp3D.
It would move a lot of development.

If AAH entity could see commercial interest, I believe
Warp3D Driver for Vampire would sell as fast as Vampire
in their stores.

In other ideas, if I was AOL, I would start selling Vampires.
US needs to get Vampirezed and we will have more You Tube videos and news :-)


Rob M

Posts 54
29 May 2017 06:35


Vojin Vidanovic wrote:

I dont believe it that easy, even its nice to see some unity.
 
  Skilled coder willing to work for free? Hmm ... I assume there is anyone willing to try, or even if it would, they must have a commercial interest.
 
  If Hans is free of Warp3D Nova and is willing to accept a public
  fundraiser be it Power2People or Kickstarter, it can be crowfounded easily as there is enough interest.
 
  Huno is willing to do Vampire ports, but needs Warp3D.
  It would move a lot of development.
 
  If AAH entity could see commercial interest, I believe
  Warp3D Driver for Vampire would sell as fast as Vampire
  in their stores.
 
  In other ideas, if I was AOL, I would start selling Vampires.
  US needs to get Vampirezed and we will have more You Tube videos and news :-)

Already asked Hans about drivers for other video cards on OS4 and he said he simply doesn't have the time for it.

Huno has ported a number of 2D games to OS4 so it should be worth getting a Vampire out to him for those.  If he's on board it's also another reason to push for a Warp3D driver.


Vojin Vidanovic

Posts 770
29 May 2017 08:30


Rob M wrote:

 
Vojin Vidanovic wrote:

  I dont believe it that easy, even its nice to see some unity.
   
    Skilled coder willing to work for free? Hmm ... I assume there is anyone willing to try, or even if it would, they must have a commercial interest.
   
    If Hans is free of Warp3D Nova and is willing to accept a public
    fundraiser be it Power2People or Kickstarter, it can be crowfounded easily as there is enough interest.
   
    Huno is willing to do Vampire ports, but needs Warp3D.
    It would move a lot of development.
   
    If AAH entity could see commercial interest, I believe
    Warp3D Driver for Vampire would sell as fast as Vampire
    in their stores.
   
    In other ideas, if I was AOL, I would start selling Vampires.
    US needs to get Vampirezed and we will have more You Tube videos and news :-)
 

 
 
  Already asked Hans about drivers for other video cards on OS4 and he said he simply doesn't have the time for it.
 
  Huno has ported a number of 2D games to OS4 so it should be worth getting a Vampire out to him for those.  If he's on board it's also another reason to push for a Warp3D driver.
 

 
  Since AAH promised drivers for 6870 that was part of my "x1000 shitsystem" I was naginng Trevor and him for ages to support their own "system" but in the end had to give up and get 7700 and Enhancer. Its not time, they arent gonna pay for that and similar can happen again (push to more pay and more hardware instead of delivery).
 
  Hans complained its complicated, same goes with Stevens famous ethernet.device for x1000. They publicy say it not priority since they supplied 10x slower net card. Well its not only speed, its also free PCI slot that are slow and TWO free to use due to space constrains onboard on x1000, and PCI-E x1 slots are unusable due to no cards with OS4 drivers. And I do have Sound Blaster live and Prism Wi-Fi card.
 
  I am eager to see what Standalone Vampire will offer, and I am glad there will be no "such betas as AAH alliance projects since 2004 up to now" where all users are unwilling beta users. That is my highest grundge over OS4 - not fully driver supported hardware even its "made for OS4" (in the end not made boards like Peg get better supported) and failure to deliver Timberwolf and LibreOffice promised since 2012.
 
  So I love Vampires "first deliver, promise much later" policy. A1200 board and Standalone are in the works, but hype begins when they can go on sale. Yes, long waiting lists and made in Bosnia, I see young Americans complaining on wait and US import procedures EXTERNAL LINK
 
  They should live in Balkans a bit where everything is on waiting list :-)
 
  In short: We should ask Hans how much he would estimate driver price, and that we are willing to Kickstarter/Power2People fundraise
 
  Gunnar said Appollo Team has "land-lease" programme ;-) Huno deserves it surely and would do 2D to RTG first, until 3D is reasolved. He sais his budget is empty after x5000, and I believe him, I am recovering from x1000 even years afterwards ;-)


Olaf Schoenweiss

Posts 684
29 May 2017 10:13


I am not against another option but I personal would prefer if the foundations would stay free (as far as possible), that includes 3D API


Vojin Vidanovic

Posts 770
29 May 2017 11:02


I am first for FLOSS as Linux user,
but that would mean someone e.g. porting Gallium to AROS 68k and SAGA/RTG/AMMX?

It would need to be done and then pushed to be a Vampire standard.

Meanwhile,as a "stopgap"
I see there was once upon time WarpOS Warp3D for AGA, CPU based.
EXTERNAL LINK 
If that could be backported, or wazp3d is usable,that is well enough to give "warp3d" a rest.


Gunnar von Boehn
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 5408
29 May 2017 11:13


my 2 cents:
 
As of today Vampire has the performance crown in regards of memory speed. Vampire easily outruns GigaHerz PowerPC systems in this regard.
 
Apollo does offer very powerful SIMD instructions which can highly accelerate ALPHA Blending, color mixing, texture mapping operations.
 
 
By focusing your efforts on areas benefitting from those strongpoints you can achieve great results, able to compete with other modern systems.
 
In other words - If I would port/write software today.
then I would port or write 2D and Semi-3D applications.
Here you can today already reach real great results.
 



Vojin Vidanovic

Posts 770
29 May 2017 11:42


Thanks Gunnar, I know Majsta and you were "fast memory maniacs".
Its great feat.

Hunno is interested, has some 2D works ported (to OS4)
and is intersted for "lease for development" Vampire.
Surely, once Warp3D or something else is in, more will be done.

Can you please take over contact with him, so we get
what you advise :-) nouvel.hugues@free.fr


Samuel Crow

Posts 401
29 May 2017 16:06


Adding to what has been said, Hollywood uses a modified Lua 5.0.2 as its runtime engine.  If somebody were to write a 68020 backend for LuaJIT and a frontend interface to the version of Lua that Hollywood uses since LuaJIT targets Lua 5.1 as a minimum, Andreas would have an easy time using the updated runtime engine.

  Most of the technology used by Hollywood is open source even though the final product is not.

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