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Why Have You Removed RTG From Gold3?page  1 2 3 

Mr Niding

Posts 459
22 Sep 2018 15:31


Ofcourse everyone wants both RTG and AGA/Native video now, including in the Alpha.
 
  But I also understand there is a limited amount of manpower to go around within the apollo team, and they probably got their reasons for not including the AGA part.
  The counterargument is "well, if they have limited manpower, they should release it with AGA+RTG included, and get alot of testing done onto all parts of the core!"
  Well, they are the core developers, and they call the shots. I enjoy the product as it is, and thru the betatesters videos like Skip/Manuel I select to look forward to the endproduct, instead of focusing on the fact that I cant use it yet.
 
  We dont talk down on you, but your reaction was completely unwarranted. If you had paid the team by the hour for a job, I could understand the reaction. Or purchased a product from a major multimillion buissniss, that has a dev team, support team etc. When you KNOW its a product of love, nerdship and enthusiasm, I adjust my expectations with regards to TIMETABLES accordingly.


John William

Posts 563
22 Sep 2018 15:48


Let us all drink water (I love water), take a deep breath....- inhales - naturally you have to exhale or..erm it will come out the other side - exhales - and be happy and move on. There is nothing to see here people, there is nothing to see.


Niclas A
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 219
22 Sep 2018 15:48


Adam Whittaker wrote:

I am sorry but I cant be the only one to be so dissapointed?

I would think so yes.
The rest is happy to test AGA games on their ECS hardware.


John William

Posts 563
22 Sep 2018 15:51


Niclas A wrote:

Adam Whittaker wrote:

  I am sorry but I cant be the only one to be so dissapointed?
 

 
  I would think so yes.
  The rest is happy to test AGA games on their ECS hardware.

I KNOW..RIGHT!!


Mr Niding

Posts 459
22 Sep 2018 15:51


John William wrote:

  Let us all drink water (I love water), take a deep breath....- inhales - naturally you have to exhale or..erm it will come out the other side - exhales - and be happy and move on. There is nothing to see here people, there is nothing to see.
 

 
If you inhale while drinking water, you drown!

@Adam Whittaker - I want you to stick around, honestly. But I also chime in when I disagree with something :)


John William

Posts 563
22 Sep 2018 15:55


Mr Niding wrote:

John William wrote:

  Let us all drink water (I love water), take a deep breath....- inhales - naturally you have to exhale or..erm it will come out the other side - exhales - and be happy and move on. There is nothing to see here people, there is nothing to see.
 

 
  If you inhale while drinking water, you drown!
 

.................

Oh yeeah.....


Renee Cousins
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 142
22 Sep 2018 16:40


Adam Whittaker wrote:

I am sorry but I cant be the only one to be so dissapointed? also I am sorry I have gone of the deep end but it always seems like people on here talk down to me or belittle me... I know its Alpha and I know the fact it exisits is amazing in its self but it seems to me Apollo team could enable RTG and AGA get rid of the cable soup and still test the AGA features - like i said it would make more sense to test AGA with RTG as they will need to co exist anyway?

The point of this alpha test is to test this specific feature set. The problem with AGA is that it is VERY complex and there are so many games and demos that took advantage of various exploits to push the Amiga to it's limits. Ideally, we would hope to get feedback like "hey, this demo doesn't look right", not complaints about which features were omitted from the test.

And seriously, having AGA in an old ECS machine is awesome even without the RTG. Personally, I've never felt that RTG was very "Amiga" and feel much more "at home" in the confines of interlaced NTSC. The fonts are all the right size, the icons look nice, even blown op up a 59-inch 4K monitor :)

AGA just works. All the demos. All the games. All the apps. RTG -- not so much. Where's my screen dragging .. why should I have to switch inputs when I play a game ... it's all terribly "hacky" and just makes the Amiga feel more like a PC. You know. Adding layers upon layers. Personally, I'd much rather have a chunky plane WITHIN the AGA confines and avoid RTG completely.


Renee Cousins
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 142
22 Sep 2018 16:41


Let's all try and be appreciative for what we have and not continually complain about what we don't.


Mr Niding

Posts 459
22 Sep 2018 16:52


Renee Cousins wrote:

Adding layers upon layers. Personally, I'd much rather have a chunky plane WITHIN the AGA confines and avoid RTG completely.

Good point!

How about higher resolutions and performance?

How far could you expand it, and how would it support modern monitors/direct DIGITAL-VIDEO?

Layers upon layers kinda hits home with me. I have a old wintel PC (2009). I have dual boot; Windows XP and Win 10. The last couple of Win 10 updates has really slowed down the OS expirience, but when the same hardware runs XP, its smooth.

So you bring up a good point.


Niclas A
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 219
22 Sep 2018 17:07


Mr Niding wrote:

Renee Cousins wrote:

  Adding layers upon layers. Personally, I'd much rather have a chunky plane WITHIN the AGA confines and avoid RTG completely.
 

 
  Good point!
 
  How about higher resolutions and performance?
 
  How far could you expand it, and how would it support modern monitors/direct DIGITAL-VIDEO?
 
  Layers upon layers kinda hits home with me. I have a old wintel PC (2009). I have dual boot; Windows XP and Win 10. The last couple of Win 10 updates has really slowed down the OS expirience, but when the same hardware runs XP, its smooth.
 
  So you bring up a good point.

Back in the Natami days they were tweaking and reverse engineering of monitor files. Bringing higher rez. Speed is already there now when not limited by old mem speeds


Adam Whittaker
(Needs Verification)
Posts 270/ 1
22 Sep 2018 19:38


The point of all this and me going mental is simple - I like a lot of the source ports... its brilliant playing doom, duke, quake and various emulators on my Amiga -and RTG makes this happen... and it makes it happen really well but I also like to play a lot of my old OCS/ECS games with WHDload and if I could do both without having to change inputs on my monitor or have 2 different inputs in the first place then that would be my ideal amiga! and that is why I am not really bothered about playing AGA but more bothered about having both native amiga and RTG over the Vampires output - if I want to play AGA games I will fire up my CD32 and pop in one of my compilation discs but thats the whole point in my opinion RTG software is much more valuble than about 5 AGA games! Yes I get angry - I am a passionate man who has been eagerly checking this page day after day for months and then I have a glimour of hope only to find it dosnt do what I was hoping for... this is then compounded by people telling me how to suck eggs!!! I appreciate people are trying to help but sometimes it just comes accross as condecending! either way I am sorry to all parties for any offence caused and wanted to clear the air.


Philippe Flype
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 299
22 Sep 2018 20:00


@Adam
 
You can be sorry, yes. You can be disappointed, this i can 200% understand. But in no way this allow you to be disrespectful and insult people. Better we forget this incident.
 
Now, to speak about your disappointement. RTG is as important to my eyes than yours, this is why i invested so much time in rewriting the vampiregfx driver for the community. I appreciate it for what it is, for the same reasons as yours. So you can be sure i will make it alive, and we have in team all the good ideas to make it live aside the chipset. But please, understand, what this alpha core is, it is a core to let people test the AGA chipset implementation. It is far from perfect, there is still lots of work to do, we know that.


Nicolas Sipieter
(Needs Verification)
Posts 115/ 1
22 Sep 2018 20:40


whaaAAAat ?
  no RTG, no fpu ?!
  this is scandalous, i want each one of you in the team to know how deeply disappointed i am.
  Now, as i am a good person, i will leave you a chance to repair the damage you've done.
 
  you have to release and send full gold3 through time, in the past,
send it to 1996 *Right Now* or otherwise i will go out to the police and tell them Everything and you will be sent to penal correction facility and get bitten dogs.
  oh and i want pizza too.


John William

Posts 563
22 Sep 2018 21:10


nicolas sipieter wrote:

  whaaAAAat ?
    no RTG, no fpu ?!
    this is scandalous, i want each one of you in the team to know how deeply disappointed i am.
    Now, as i am a good person, i will leave you a chance to repair the damage you've done.
   
    you have to release and send full gold3 through time, in the past,
  send it to 1996 *Right Now* or otherwise i will go out to the police and tell them Everything and you will be sent to penal correction facility and get bitten dogs.
    oh and i want pizza too.
 

 
Let us stop pickering and close the topic ones and for good.
 


Nicolas Sipieter
(Needs Verification)
Posts 115/ 1
22 Sep 2018 21:40


maybe i should lower the level of my jokes so people could understand what they are ?
or maybe i just lacked a smiley ?
that would be sad, as it would mean people don't understand what they read and just wait for the smiley label to see how they should react.
anyway, apollo-guys, i'm still waiting for the pizza. c'mon hurry up !



Manuel Jesus

Posts 155
22 Sep 2018 23:25


Alpha status was clearly listed in instructions. Did you read instructions before download? This was made pretty clear I even showed it to some folks who where non Amiga fans and they understood what was going on with the download.


Manuel Jesus

Posts 155
22 Sep 2018 23:28


the goal is to get to eventually RTG and AGA in same core. V4 boards actally have the ability to hose two cores. No one is trying to grind you down and we just want to help out.


Manuel Jesus

Posts 155
22 Sep 2018 23:29


actually your passion on the matter is admirable.


Vojin Vidanovic
(Needs Verification)
Posts 1916/ 1
22 Sep 2018 23:30


Adam Whittaker wrote:

you are wrong - a real world test would test Both AGA and RTG together as they need to function side by side - John William go fuck yourself i am sick of this whole community.

Cannot be done now. Be patient, surely later cores and V4 cores will have it all.


Vojin Vidanovic
(Needs Verification)
Posts 1916/ 1
23 Sep 2018 09:32


Adam Whittaker wrote:

    I can only assume you have removed it or deactivated it which to me is a backwards step! What the hell is going on?
 

 
  Its not finished core, there are v2 space contrains, and as advised, you are free to flash back to 2.10-2.11 anytime if you need RTG.
 
  All in one will be possible with V4s.

Please take care of your language and emotions. If you dont like features, you can always take the Vamp out and sell it. I am sure it will sell fast.

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