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Apollo Core Cpu Demo/ Open Source Variant?page  1 2 

Matthew Langtry

Posts 199
21 May 2018 18:17


Gunnar von Boehn wrote:

Matthew Langtry wrote:

  so into total I have paid 112+ 14 + 62.50 = 188.50,
 

   
  I see that your have very good intentions, but I see 2 issues here.
   
  Issue B)
   
  190 UK pound is not that so much cheaper than Vamp.
  And if the Vampire would be produced in higher batch numbers it could be sold for the same price or for even lower price.
   
  So if someone likes to produce a "real AMIGA" board in higher numbers to give people a good board, that can be produced and maintained for years - and wants to make the board inexpensive for the buyers.
   
  I hope you can see that your good intentions
  will in the end make a real AMIGA board more expensive.
   
   
  I hope you can see these issues which could hurt your plans.
   
   
  Asides these possible issues we could talk about supporting you - but I think it would be kind of important to get a guarantee that these boards will be available the next 2 years.

ps it  only costs 190 pound if want io board or aio  board with built in sdram for 2nd micro sd slot, vga out, toslink and 3.5 mm audio, can just purchase sdram card, only core present explicitly use 2nd sdram slot is x68000 core.

112 de nano board, sd ram module is 15 to 20 pounds.

de 10 nano board has allrerading  1000 in stock and only take factory 28 days to build another 1000. I doubt apollo team can beat intel at manufacturing electronics.


M Rickan

Posts 177
21 May 2018 18:37


Matthew Langtry wrote:

  de 10 nano board has allrerading  1000 in stock and only take factory 28 days to build another 1000. I doubt apollo team can beat intel at manufacturing electronics.

I think anyone who comes up with a licensed solution will have some inherent risks but it's also unlikely that these units will just vanish from the market.

We really do need a high volume, inexpensive solution.


Matthew Langtry

Posts 199
21 May 2018 18:44


hence why brought to attention of apollo team. Surely better to have more users,developers using apollo core than just those who can afford a vampire setup.

obviously if v4 standalone is cheaper than de10 nano board im wrong but i doubt it if intel are breaking even with there boards.



Vojin Vidanovic
(Needs Verification)
Posts 1916/ 1
21 May 2018 19:13


Matthew Langtry wrote:

  obviously if v4 standalone is cheaper than de10 nano board im wrong but i doubt it if intel are breaking even with there boards.
 

 
  You are looking it just price-wise. What is a bit unclear was did license give just cutback CPU, or some chipset support (GOLD 2.9/GOLD3 core) availiability?
 
  Other section is reverse situation. Having similar product both HW feature wise and Vamp core feature wise, even under license, could hurt v4 launch and post core3 development.
 
  If just reduced CPU core could be lincensed (as replacement from TG core) + Minimig/MISTER chipset features or some similar solution could be found, it might be a source of revenue for the team and other AC080 avail board (by licensing or charging end users to unlock core to 100Mhz speed)- might bring POSITIVE results such es board spread and variety of offer, more users/developers in mid and long term run.
 
  That would be my 2 cents, not related to team decisions.


Ronnie Beck

Posts 37
22 May 2018 12:16


Matthew Langtry wrote:

  de 10 nano board has allrerading  1000 in stock and only take factory 28 days to build another 1000. I doubt apollo team can beat intel at manufacturing electronics.

Very few companies can.  But Intel strength manufacturing isn't required here.

I like the idea of an open sourced amiga implemented in FPGA.  The idea that regular free updates which bring bug fixes and newer features to my beloved platform is really exciting.  The MISTer looks on paper really awesome.  But what is the end goal here? Once you have this DE10 Nano board based Amiga running, what comes next?  Just publish the blue prints to the community so others can build it?  Release a commercial product (assuming you can solve potential licensing obstacles and find price parity with parts)?

I think beyond academic curiosity , the audience for the MISTer is limited.  And certainly doesn't need Intel might to supply the interested parties.  I suspect that retro gamers (whom you say you represent) are more interested playing the old games on pre-built purpose built hardware.  Soldering a kit together, sourcing all the compatible parts and then troubleshooting it all is.....another breed altogether.

Matthew Langtry wrote:

obviously if v4 standalone is cheaper than de10 nano board im wrong but i doubt it if intel are breaking even with there boards.

Any commercial offering will never be able to compete pricewise with a educational board if, as you imply, they are subsidised by Intel.  But the goals of such projects are different.  Intel might take a financial hit by subsidising such chips and boards to students, but they increase the number of engineers who have hands on experience with their product, hence reducing one barrier for wider adoption: availability of capable/knowledgable engineers.  So in the long run they get there money back through, potentially, increased sales of their FPGAs.  This doesn't in anyway compare with the vampire boards: a product fit for a specific purpose. And a very different purpose at that.  Such comparisons (price or otherwise) are not helpful here.

What ever your goal is, I say press on.  I would be seriously interested to see how that project would evolve and if, during it's evolution, it becomes beyond a well-intentioned idea and transitions into something wonderful (like the Vampire boards) and eventually something I would consider buying.  In the worst case, you will learn a heck of a lot trying.  That is never a bad thing.


Matthew Langtry

Posts 199
22 May 2018 13:33


Email Reply from terasic:- "Terasic - Sharon Liu <sales14@terasic.com>
09:39 (3 hours ago)
to me
Dear Matt,

There's very little risk about the discontinuity of our DE10-Nano until 2023. That being said, we'll definitely give you a heads up at least a year prior to the discontinuity and the chance for last time buy.

Kindly let me know if you have any other questions.

Kind regards,
Sharon

terasic logo
       
Sharon Liu
Sales Department
TEL: +886-3-575-0880 #322
FAX: +886-3-572-6690
Not satisfied with our customer service?
Send your feedback to us at feedback@terasic.com  "

Kind Regards

Matt


Vojin Vidanovic
(Needs Verification)
Posts 1916/ 1
22 May 2018 16:00


Jerome Tredez wrote:

Personally I would prefer to have the opposite: all the Mister core on the Vampire V4 hardware :-)

Since both are Cyclone V, this is also possible, and would be great!

MIST used to support 20 home computers beside Amiga and Atari (and could bring full ST compatibility), 10 consoles and few old arcades
EXTERNAL LINK


Eric Gus

Posts 477
23 May 2018 07:30


Vojin Vidanovic wrote:

MIST used to support 20 home computers

Used to?  It still does..  I use my mist still ..

  .. and more .. also arcade machines and Vectrex was just added..  as well as a bunch of odd russian cold war era systems.. and some other rare stuff.



Vojin Vidanovic
(Needs Verification)
Posts 1916/ 1
23 May 2018 09:44


eric gus wrote:

    .. and more .. also arcade machines and Vectrex was just added..  as well as a bunch of odd russian cold war era systems.. and some other rare stuff.

 
  Loved those z80 on muscles, showing 8-bits aint dead yet, thanks to Iron Curtain/Yugoslav ban on "computer tech" placed on 48k for import or COMECON (Warsaw Pact trade part) products only (lower then Spectrum) availiability. Work of the people and computer love!
 
  Nice thing, it would be great to see those ported to Mister/v4 Vamps/v2 Vamps where possible. If anyone is willing to do it, kickstarter and similar bounty could be opened.
 
  I used past tense because Mist seems to cease development and availiability and Mister is under development (20 cores ported so far + Linux)


Eric Gus

Posts 477
24 May 2018 07:58


Vojin Vidanovic wrote:

 
  I used past tense because Mist seems to cease development and availiability and Mister is under development (20 cores ported so far + Linux)

Its slowed but its not ceased .. and there are still mist units available, (and clones)..  I wouldn't put it in the past-tense just yet.


Vojin Vidanovic
(Needs Verification)
Posts 1916/ 1
24 May 2018 16:17


eric gus wrote:

  Its slowed but its not ceased .. and there are still mist units available, (and clones)..  I wouldn't put it in the past-tense just yet.

I see Amedia lists it and cores are avail on Wiki, so yes, "dont call I duppy (ghost)! but ... once hw/sw development cease, its more and more history. Unless development taken over.


Eric Gus

Posts 477
24 May 2018 22:48


Vojin Vidanovic wrote:

eric gus wrote:

  Its slowed but its not ceased .. and there are still mist units available, (and clones)..  I wouldn't put it in the past-tense just yet.
 

 
  I see Amedia lists it and cores are avail on Wiki, so yes, "dont call I duppy (ghost)! but ... once hw/sw development cease, its more and more history. Unless development taken over.

Clones still exist as well .. AFAIK those are still being made ..



Matthew Langtry

Posts 199
30 May 2018 22:52


Gunnar von Boehn wrote:

Matthew Langtry wrote:

  So is the official stance from Apollo Team now not supporting open source now?
 

  Why you make this up?
  You know that we did not say this.

Never mind im confuzzled

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