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Star Wars 3D Gamepage  1 2 3 

Manuel Jesus

Posts 99
23 Nov 2017 13:38


Fan films do this all the time as long as you aren't selling product its not really viewed as a threat. Every Star Wars inspired demo would be pulled off Aminet if using Star Wars or Star Trek assets in a demo was an issue. George Lucas himself was a big supporter or fan film work and that seems to have continued with Disney. The problem is when folks are piggish and start selling product.
 
  Aside from the Star Wars arcade game the closest I saw a Star Wars game come to Amiga was spotting the AmigaCd32 in the background of  a picture featured in the STAR WARS: REBEL ASSAULT behind the scenes art book. Curiously enough they used Amigas for the sound playack system in the Rebal Assault Series of PC-CDROM games.

   


Olaf Schoenweiss
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 393
23 Nov 2017 14:55


Yes I thought that too... attorneys would be happy about that ;)


' Meltigator '

Posts 5
24 Nov 2017 10:59


Hi to all,

In 1991, with some friends we wrote a demo of a game called "Astro".

It was a Shoot 'Em Up game with a top view (alien breed type), it had a very fast scrolling (nothing like that at the time!)
on OCS was written in assembler directly on hardware and squeezed a lot of Amiga managing many contemporary animations.

It was shown to SMAU (Milan / Italy) at Pysgnosis and Team 17, who had remained very enthusiastic..

There was a pre-contract with Team 17,unfortunately the project never got released/completed due to different commitments of the components ..

Somewhere in the cellar I should still have some backup of the project if I find it I'll upload it on aminet..

I recently made a small demo (sorry on windoze ..) written in Cpp / asmx86 + OGL / D3D using the Ogre3D library (someone in the past tried to get it ported on Amiga ..) I called "Astro 3D ".. the video is awful(sorry),
I have a much better incomplete version better.

EXTERNAL LINK 
I think that making a 3d game style demo is a great idea!

From the beginning Amiga has always had great demos, I remember in the 80's, "Crimetown Depths"(I knew some people in that team):

EXTERNAL LINK 
Unfortunately that project was never completed either..



Mr Niding

Posts 202
24 Nov 2017 12:29


Checked both links, and the drawings are very nice. The Astro 3D video was rough as you say, but shows promise for sure :)


Gunnar von Boehn
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 3039
24 Nov 2017 12:34


I very much like the Game demo you linked!




' Meltigator '

Posts 5
24 Nov 2017 15:04


Many thanks!
 
  The idea of "Astro 3D" based on original project "Astro" was to blend the best of the past, when important was  playability,with recent technology, adding a never repetitive scheme  always different and a self-adaptation technology to the player to make something of really different.
 
  Certainly it is a very pretentious project, perhaps because of "too many" years of games and matches.. :)
 
  Although, as I have heard from many programmers, in the end it is more fun "create" than "to play"..
 


Samuel Crow
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 264
24 Nov 2017 18:03


I think the current versions of Ogre3D were written in C++11 so we'll need a good, recent GCC or equivalent.  That would bounce us back to Bebbo's cross-compiler version of GCC 6.3.1 which is not fully bug fixed.

At one point I suggested porting the old Irrlicht graphics engine on the NatAmi page.  It internally used 15bit color back then to be faster on some hardware.  The otherwise unused sign bit became a transparency mask for the pixel data.  There aren't many games that still use Irrlicht though.  Even Super Tux Kart uses an independent fork of Irrlicht called Antarctica.


' Meltigator '

Posts 5
25 Nov 2017 13:35


I know Irrlicht is very good, certainly much lighter than 3d Ogre, which requires many resources, but with  excellent results .

As far as the most commonly used videogames are Unity3D, the demand for resources increases  and very good results.

However, I really like urho3d ( ..to merge Ogre3d and Horde3d.. ), runs a little anywhere, I was doing some tests on a raspberry, then maybe I'll go to a clock ... :)

I read on Ogre's forum that a guy had developed port of Ogre on Amiga (I think with Amikit), AmiOgre, although I did not find a trace on the net:

EXTERNAL LINK 



' Meltigator '

Posts 5
25 Nov 2017 15:57



Greetings...!

EXTERNAL LINK 


Samuel Crow
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 264
25 Nov 2017 16:59


The forum thread link works but the link to the sources is broken in that thread.  If it is at 11 fps on a PPC 603e using StormMesa, it will be barely playable on a Vampire v2 due to the software floating point.


Markus Horbach

Posts 35
25 Nov 2017 18:07


Just my 2 cents, but a 2D parallax scrolling playfield with some transparency and multiple layers will need the memory bandwidth offered by vampire. The additional calculating power of the 68080 could be used for smooth animations like starships rendered in 3d and some paricle effects for the explosions. You will need all the power a vampire offers to do this in 1280x720@60fps.

Open Tyrian 68k has for example no transparent clouds, the PC version has transparent clouds as an option for Pentium MMX.
Maybe add AMMX support for transparent clouds ?

Full 640x480@60fps 3D graphics games were only possible on a Voodoo1 accelerator or a Pentium II class CPU (unreal 1 engine offered pure software rendering with high res settings).

Choppy 3D graphics at 11fps will be not as impressive as an shoot-em-up at 60fps with a lot of fancy 2D effects.

Just do the math how many clock cycles you will need to fill 1/2 of the high res screen with textured 3D objects. Space games were so popular because of the big amount of black space to render, or a static cockpit as overlay.

Why do you not polish up the 194x demo from gunnar ? A lot of people liked it and a playable demo would be wonderful.


' Meltigator '

Posts 5
26 Nov 2017 09:50



All true, many problems, I think "Only Amiga Makes It Possible" ..

But someone seems to have done it on c64:

EXTERNAL LINK 



Niclas A
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 148
26 Nov 2017 09:58


' Meltigator ' wrote:

  All true, many problems, I think "Only Amiga Makes It Possible" ..
 
  But someone seems to have done it on c64:
 
  EXTERNAL LINK 
 


April fools


Markus Horbach

Posts 35
26 Nov 2017 12:29


>But someone seems to have done it on c64

There is a big gap between "everything realtime rendered" and "clever prerendering animations". The visuals may be the same for the user, but the hardware needed to make it possible is different.
Prerendered animations need lot of RAM. 128MB is very much for a game engine, you can create a lot of fancy visual effects to pretty up your game demo. But it showcases only the skills of your graphics artist prerendering some pixelart and load it from disk to RAM.
Realtime rendering needs programming skills to make it fast and a hardware with some gfx accelerating features like AMMX. it is more flexible than prerendered stuff, but not every visual effect needs realtime rendering.

The head in the C64 demo rotates only in one axis and has some zoom effect. this is where calculating time and prerendering is balanced. the background is very blurry and low res with few colours to save memory to save the RAM for prerendered pictures of the head which are prepared to do only 2 effects, rotate one axis and zoom. the lumination of the head is prerendered obviously, a C64 cant do that realtime.
See the description of the video !


Samuel Crow
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 264
26 Nov 2017 20:41


@Meltigator
 
  What we'll need to implement a 3d engine on the Vampire using AMMX2 would probably be an open source fixed point renderer like the old Scene Render algorithm from Allegro 4.3 or so.  Even Irrlicht uses floating point for its software renderer which slows it down on Vampire v2.  Ogre3D would be even slower.

Edit:
Link to Scene Render 4.3 source code:  EXTERNAL LINK


Thellier Alain

Posts 35
27 Nov 2017 10:03


>forum that a guy had developed port of Ogre on Amiga
A 1st april post ;-P

 
>3D engines like Irrlicht, 3d Ogre, Unity3D :

This is not a solution:
1) As those engines are not (I suppose) Open Source or have too much dependancies to be ported on Amigaois systems: They dont exist on OS4 so certainly there is too much dependancies
2) Having those engines but for porting what ? Is there a GOOD & OPEN SOURCE Irrlicht game ? (I mean not Super Tux Kart that is painly slow)
3) Even if there are open source games : there are mainly Android or Windows with lots of other OS dependancies

A I said before: It will need first to have a fast 3D renderer on Vampire (kinda Warp3D api) before dreaming to a full game

Some self advertising:
Also the only advanced existing 3D engine for OS3&OS4 is Microbe3D:
EXTERNAL LINK  EXTERNAL LINK 



Gunnar von Boehn
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 3039
27 Nov 2017 10:33


thellier alain wrote:

This is not a solution

Alain, I fully agree with you.




Markus B

Posts 23
28 Nov 2017 09:25


Besides, what's the purpose of bringing stuff to an (accelerated) Amiga if only for porting games which run much better on any other platform?
  Even all the Quake/Doom stuff is only nice for benchmarking, some sentimental fun.
 
  The magic of a vampirized Amiga could be for coders to create something unique. Something, which is comfortable to program and where the system has strengths.
  So, make an engine, which takes advantage of AMMX and new SAGA screenmodes, new audio features etc. Good old joystick style games.
 
  A strength could be to have perfectly synchronized 50 FPS on such a system.
  Something to show off, what a merely 100 MHz system is capable of running.

For example, take a look at EXTERNAL LINK  It's based on a rather old game engine from the 90s and has moderate requirements.
With a game engine which supports the Apollo features in a nice way (of course it may include 3D stuff as AMMX is very powerful), this could create the base for some nice games.


Olaf Schoenweiss
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 393
28 Nov 2017 09:52


I think 2D was the strength of Amiga and should be the strength of Vampire. To compete with modern platforms using newest graphic cards is simply unrealistic


Gunnar von Boehn
(Apollo Team Member)
Posts 3039
28 Nov 2017 10:32


I fully agree with you,
that the expectations need be realistic.

- The VAMPIRE is excellent for doing 2D games.

- The Vampire also offers a lot more 3D power than a PLAYSTATION one did had. So if people wanted then they can create some 3D games on VAMP.



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